Hi @Littlelost that sounds like a good cautionary tale. Maybe it just doesn't seem real to her yet. Also hopefully it's a phase, since it's very recent.   I totally love the idea that her washing came back to her, IMO you should definitely do more of that stuff, if she wants to be independent, then she needs to know what it feels like to be independent.   Maybe she feels she's been too smothered?   One thing for sure, this "text only, please" like she's some busy CEO, how is that even a thing, geez. It probably does stem from her wanting her independence, but 16 is a bit too young to move out.  However, maybe it's a good time to try and simulate that as fully as possible, including all the responsibilities from her end. If she was shocked that her washing came back, then maybe life has been too easy for her. ... View more

This is the part that concerns me most (far beyond her messy room): Now she is staying out later and I told her to let me know where she was and not to use public transport after a certain hour. She used to let me know where she was and when she would be home but lately this has stopped and I feel like I am begging for any information. ... The one and only thing asked of her now is that she lets us know where she is and how she is getting home and she isn’t doing that and basically just ignores my texts ... My 19 year old son never behaved like this so I am at a loss Obviously this is an extreme danger and we don't want her to just suddenly not turn up one night. I'm concerned about this and my responses are around this specifically, and I wonder if @Littlelost has anything more to say on it.   From the original post, I get the impression everything has been fine up until the last few months.  Perhaps this is just a phase, she's suddenly had an awakening where she's got in with a group of friends where she's getting to experience more "adult" things, and the life at home has been very childlike and she wants to break out of it now. She sees her mother in the center of that and doesn't think anything she has to say is relevant, because she's only seen her in the context of child rearing.   Perhaps it's time to talk to her like an adult, about the kinds of thing she's getting up to, show her you've been there, done that, she'll probably be surprised, even horrified / grossed out, and warn her of the bad things that could happen to her. You probably have some scary stories you personally experienced or things that happened to people you know.   I have to credit my grandma giving me a healthy dose of fear around always listening to my parents. I must've been a bit younger than 10 when she told me what I think was a news story centering around children not listening to their parents and coming back home to find them both dead.  It may sound extreme or strange out of context while I'm trying to summarise it here, but the point is -  it didn't mentally scar me, but the chilling story introduced to me just a bit of the reality around what kind of dangers are out there, and to trust your parents to look after you.   The other thing is my father and mother both had spanking from a young age as a form of punishment, so to be so rebellious as to flat out ignore them on a regular basis - or even stay out late by the time we were teenagers, wasn't even fathomable. The few times we made a mistake we came home to a crying angry mother that was worried sick about us, and that brought us back into line pretty quick.   Hoping by sharing some of my experiences it might give @Littlelost some insight or ideas. Every parenting situation is different and no parenting situation is perfect. ... View more

Thanks @Philippa-RO , I thought I would come by here for some advice, but when I saw some of the existing questions, I thought I would stay for a bit and contribute first.   I'm having trouble quoting previous replies in a single post, so I'lll make a 2nd post. ... View more

  It is quite normal to need these feelings in your life -If you're just taking the device away and repressing the behaviour, where's the outlet? What alternative way have you given him to have those feelings?    It's impossible for you to come up with an answer for that of course; how we get involved with the people we like and what we like them is a very personal thing.    And it's not Discord itself, that's just a method of communication, in my day it was Yahoo chat. You might even be cutting off other forms of social interaction he has if he's formed other friend networks through there. You'll have to check that for yourself by talking with him.    Likely because he's so introverted, online chat is the first real intimacy he's had with a woman, and I'm speaking from experience . When I was a teenager, I was not encouraged to go out and make friends and given a good model of how to socialise at the time (though I think my parents did their best, they just didn't know how to do any better), so I had a similar experience, and I guess I'm lucky they just never found out. In the end, due to external messaging from society, I found my own drive to move out and grow as a person. Not everyone is so lucky though.  The lucky ones have parents that have the urge to give them examples of how to socialise, either consiously or not, by having people over, family gatherings, going out, etc.    This boy needs direction, it's not enough to say he's introverted and leave him alone, he needs a good model for how to go out and make real life connections instead of semi-real ones online.     Your son might be the only outlet for this girl's sanity, and while on one hand some other random family's problems are not yours to bear, on the other hand this could be a very important relationship to him and his development. This is his first intimate experience, and the feelings he will associate with this by you cutting her out are going to affect his development whether you like it or not. At the same time, you're right about being concerned about the level of inappropriate influence, but the flood gates are opened, you won't convince him this is a "bad" thing now, it feels too good.     And his care for her welfare won't go away with you banning the device either. He will always wonder what happened to her and resent you for it.    I think it's very possible you're too worried about the content of the messages and it's possible that cutting her out will do more damage to his social development than whatever fantasies they are exploring. Again, speaking from experience.    The long term importance is he learns to move towards having connections with people in real life, before he gets addicted to what he knows. Again, speaking from experience. It wasn't too bad, I just had to change what gets me "turned on". I was too used to imagining it instead of doing it.    In my opinion you should talk with him about what is appropriate for his age and what he needs to work towards so he can experience these things in real life.  It will be a transition. One of the big realisations for me was when one of my online girlfriends was moving on, and told me "You have to find real people, that you can touch and hug for real".  Something to that effect.  It didn't happen instantly but it was one little thing of many things that caused a transition over time.  ... View more

You seem like an extremely lovely, kind and generous parent, and no one can fault you there.     Human beings need motivation in both positive and negative forms. You as an adult, may tell yourself that you don't speed because you are a good person and don't want to cause any deaths, but the moment you back off the accelerator when you see the speed limit sign, you're thinking of the speeding tickets you've got, and nobody is the exception here.   Children are motivated by the same combination of positive and negative stimulus, it's a primal thing and it's how our brains work.   The bar for what is a difficult task for her to do may be very low, and the annoying feeling of having to do it outweighs any promise of positive action that may follow it. It's in this case that us grown up adults put on a stiff upper lip and just get up in the morning and clean the house or earn a weeks wage - because it needs doing.  We don't want our family to starve, and we don't want to live in squalor.  Those are negative consiquences that we've already had a close enough brush with that we take enough action to keep them at bay.  And as adults it's our job to teach children this fact of life and prepare them for the real world.  It's just as essential a part of nurturing as making them feel safe and ensuring they have fun and freedoms.   You are absolutely right that you have no currency to work with - I couldn't see any in your description of your relationship with her, in fact, I couldn't even see a positive currency, let alone a negative currency (or leverage, I should say).  That may just be the way it is, because being a parent is hard to find time for everything, but if you're not "relevant" in her life to the point where she thinks you're just not cool enough to "get it" and nagging her about things that just cause her to have less fun, there's no way you have any positive leverage.   You can execute your negative leverage (removing conveniences, etc.) but of course if you don't have the rapport built up, it's likely to cause resentment.   Not an easy thing to solve, this problem has been brewing for a long time. But for sure, the immediate problem is she sees no "reason" why she has to do those things. It's just you annoying her. And sometimes, children are too young to really understand the long term consequences of things, so we have different levels of punishments.  ... View more